Check your intakes!

I am by no means bashing TFS stuff but wanted to show you guys a couple of things I have run into to possibly help others from running into headaches that I have. We all expect when we pay strong money for higher end parts that they will be great higher end parts but I have learned that you can't assume that it is a great part because you paid the price for a higher end part. From now on, no matter who's name is on it, or how much it cost, it will be THROUGHLY examined for quality.

The video below is from a TFS R series for the A heads. I noticed Q16 on the driver front intake runner after a few passes right up under the accelerator pump of the carb after a few passes on a new build. At first I thought it was the carb leaking so I wiped it off, made sure the primary bowl and accelerator pump housing was tight (which it was) and made another pass. Again, had the fuel on the runner. At this time, I still thought it was coming from the carb. This was a test session so I was also testing carbs. Wped the runner off again, switched carbs, and again had fuel in the same spot. Then, I knew something funny was going on. I looked closely at the runner and seen porosity in that runner. Skipping into the future a bit, while the intake was off, we pressure tested the intake...



If looking up the runners, on each corner of the intake at the carb flange, there were big nasty porosity pockets on each corner. They sent me another intake to replace and it pressure tested good. Then it was noticed that the bolt down holes were shifted forward. Mocked up on the engine and the runners wouldn't line up. Here are pics of intake gaskets lined up with the bolt down holes. One is with the gasket backwards, one is with it correct just to show that gasket direction was not the issue. Also a top view pic showing how off center from the casting the holes where drilled...







Intake 3 on the way. Hopefully it will be correct. I guarantee every intake I buy or ANY part for that matter will be examined closely and every intake will be pressure tested before going on an engine. I have to say, and not just by this intake situation, I am very disappointed in QC of american made products these days.

I got a TFS "Track Heat" 460 regular port size manifold which had a seeper, (porosity), on the underside of the front water crossover. Must have spent over $100.00 on oil when trying to figure where the excess moisture in the crankcase was coming from.

A $400.00 manifold ended up costing well over $600.00 in gaskets and oil and oil filters - plus: (not to mention the exorbitant amount of time it took to find it).

 i think the more you pay for parts the more work it takes to make use of them. some things i make myself so if it dont work or dont fit i know why.  

Yea ya know whats really crazy,is we bitch a lot about Chinese,jap,etc. products,when usa made parts are just as bad sometimes.

bbf-falcon wrote:Yea ya know whats really crazy,is we bitch a lot about Chinese,jap,etc. products,when usa made parts are just as bad sometimes.

Most companies QC is not up to par these days they just there to get a pay check and don't care how the product is as long as it looks right. I think high end parts needs to be checked better and should not have to have mods made on every thing it is put on. I know mods have to be made sometimes for them to work on a certain engine but you should not have to on every engine on a basic build.

That was the issue I was having with all 9 different sets of small block heads I had from them. Went to a different company now with a HIP casting.

I'm sure they will work it out eventually.

is the way everything from tfs is.they must have had some new people or a new foundry?either way,thats a pain in the ass having to send everything back to get it replaced.i had a set of small block heads when they first came out,and the guides were set at the wrong angle and wore out very quickly.tfs replaced all the guides and did a valve job for free for me.only cost shipping to get it fixed.

They next day aired me intake #3 and their engineer personally checked it over before it went out the door. Got it today. Fingers crossed....

They next day aired me intake #3 and their engineer personally checked it over before it went out the door. Got it today. Fingers crossed....

id woulda just put some epoxy on the original intake and went w it...... you shouldnt have too but damn what a hassle.


fwiw my mafia intake has several tubes of jb weld on it and it works fine.......

richter69 wrote:id woulda just put some epoxy on the original intake and went w it...... you shouldnt have too but damn what a hassle.


fwiw my mafia intake has several tubes of jb weld on it and it works fine.......

If you seen it in person, I doubt you would have run it. I had a couple of cylinders that got gouged. I am suspecting that it came from casting flash from the 4 nasty porosity pockets at the corners of the carb flange on the inside but I cant prove it.

TFS can blame their casting Co. for the their porous problems,but not for their quality control. 

soupbean wrote:

richter69 wrote:id woulda just put some epoxy on the original intake and went w it...... you shouldnt have too but damn what a hassle.


fwiw my mafia intake has several tubes of jb weld on it and it works fine.......

If you seen it in person, I doubt you would have run it. I had a couple of cylinders that got gouged. I am suspecting that it came from casting flash from the 4 nasty porosity pockets at the corners of the carb flange on the inside but I cant prove it.

you should see the inside of my intake lol. granted nothing is loose and gonna get in the cylinder though.

Intake 3 fits heads correctly and has no leaks  

   

WTF...is American quality control slipping to china standards. It would really be a shame if procomp schitt surpassed stuff made in the
USA    

Where's that TFS guy to come on here and cry foul and try to place the blame on the end user because it is their fault for not pointing out the problems to TFS representatives at least 11 times over the phone; (ten calls isn't enough).

They will never admit publicly that anything like this was their fault ... just ask 'em. There is always someone else for them to shift the blame.

I use some of their stuff because it does work when right but, as for treating customers like real people - that company sucks.

rmcomprandy wrote:Where's that TFS guy to come on here and cry foul and try to place the blame on the end user because it is their fault for not pointing out the problems to TFS representatives at least 11 times over the phone; (ten calls isn't enough).

They will never admit publicly that anything like this was their fault ... just ask 'em. There is always someone else for them to shift the blame.

I use some of their stuff because it does work when right but, as for treating customers like real people - that company sucks.

When I said that three years ago people acted like I was crazy or something.

careful this thread will get locked or deleted ..... 

All manufacturers have some type of trouble every now and then.

Hopefully you all will lighten up in regards to being on TFS's azz. My best suggestion to you, is that you yourself go try and cast some parts such as heads and manifolds. Like what Micheal Green at Pro-Filer told me one time; "If this was easy, everybody would be doing it". Every company in the business from Buddy Bar, to Allied, Brodix, TFS, Dart, A/R and others have had their fair share of blems. For this very reason, Danny Bee switched from cast timing covers to billet timing covers.

Personally, I think the quality of cast alum. racing parts throughout the industry, is much better now than it was 20 and 30 years ago. Brodix and Dart still are "Chevy oriented" companies and they only make some small block Ford heads, but no big block Ford heads or manifolds for us. Therefore I have been thankful for TFS, because they have been a staunch supporter of the big block Ford since their humble beginnings with Mike and Rick Smith.

Charlie Evans

I only speak for myself but I do understand casting is not easy but......

It's not that I'm pissed about.  It's the fact that I was treated like crap when I brought an issue up to them.  That was after sitting on hold for over an hour just to get hanged up on and then calling back and speaking to the same person and he acted like he has never heard the story before.  This ended up being a 6 month ordeal which ended with me buying a new casting from them just so I could test out their "new" casting ( which is a lot better) and then selling everything tfs.  I have switched to edelbrock hip heads now with great success.  This was all small block stuff. I've seen less issues with the big block stuff.

Their customer service not the castings lost a customer in me.

c.evans wrote:Hopefully you all will lighten up in regards to being on TFS's azz.  My best suggestion to you, is that you yourself go try and cast some parts such as heads and manifolds.  Like what Micheal Green at Pro-Filer told me one time; "If this was easy, everybody would be doing it". Every company in the business from Buddy Bar, to Allied, Brodix, TFS, Dart, A/R and others have had their fair share of blems. For this very reason, Danny Bee switched from cast timing covers to billet timing covers.

Personally, I think the quality of cast alum. racing parts throughout the industry, is much better now than it was 20 and 30 years ago. Brodix and Dart still are "Chevy oriented" companies and they only make some small block Ford heads, but no big block Ford heads or manifolds for us.  Therefore I have been thankful for TFS, because they have been a staunch supporter of the big block Ford since their humble beginnings with Mike and Rick Smith.

Charlie Evans

I agree. Even though this thread states "check your intakes", this thread was not meant to be directed at TFS. It was directed at all manufactures of intakes and all parts for that matter. I have seen it first hand with a race part manufacture I once worked for and more recently with a few other manufactures that have "grown". During this growing phase, the quality control seems to be less of a focus and getting parts out the door as quickly as possible for bottom line numbers seems to have become the main priority. I understand that the bottom line numbers are extremely important and can make the difference between the doors staying open or closing for good, but it is disappointing that the things that made said business successful to begin with was making "quality" parts. Why does QC need to be an area where numbers can be cut? To me, that should be a part of the manufacturing process that is second to none of the rest of the manufacturing process. Again, based off watching with my own eyes, when you do not make QC a top priority of the company, a violent downward spiral WILL occur. It is extremely frustruating for the consumer. In this situation, TFS has made things right in which I appreciate greatly. That does not change the fact that an evaluation of their QC dept obviously is needed. Along with many of todays mass production producers....

whatbumper wrote:I only speak for myself but I do understand casting is not easy but......

It's not that I'm pissed about.  It's the fact that I was treated like crap when I brought an issue up to them.  That was after sitting on hold for over an hour just to get hanged up on and then calling back and speaking to the same person and he acted like he has never heard the story before.  This ended up being a 6 month ordeal which ended with me buying a new casting from them just so I could test out their "new" casting ( which is a lot better) and then selling everything tfs.  I have switched to edelbrock hip heads now with great success.  This was all small block stuff.  I've seen less issues with the big block stuff.

Their customer service not the castings lost a customer in me.

I understand and I apologize on their behalf for the customer service issues. I am sorry about that. I'm just saying that if it wasn't for TFS, we wouldn't be where we are today in terms of BB Fords making "killer power" and being a very good Sportsman racing engine.

Where I was coming from is that I have ported, flowed, and fixed around 275 sets of big block Ford heads.  All the brands, IDT, EX 514, Blue Thunder, Ford FRPP, Edelbrock, Pro-Filer and TFS, have had problems that needed to be fixed and dealt with.

I have also had the opportunity to do considerable R&D work for TFS, Pro-Filer, and TM (Todd Miller's company) and those three have been a pleasure to work with.

Charlie Evans

shit happens, nothing you can do about that.

now poor customer service, that doesn't have to happen.....