New style starter.....Heros wanted

So is it not supposed to look like this! Car backfired while starting through the carb, this was the result!

Intital timing is set to 10degrees, could this be why my car is backfiring rhough the carb right now........

Frank,
Your starter does not look very good.
My engines like to start with the base timing set at 30 to 32 degrees, with a timing computer backing the timing off about 10 degrees during cranking.
This is with a crank trigger setup and MSD stuff.
I am not sure if you have a crank trigger..or not.
If you do have a crank trigger, check your rotor phasing. It may be trying to fire the wrong cylinder.
Backfire....normally tells me that too lean...not enough timing advance, or an intake valve leaking..or no lash.... (on an established...running engine.) If it is a new engine...I will go back to the rotor phasing check, and make sure I didn't mess up..or swap plug wires.
The starter is not dead. Just go to the parts store and pick up a new starter drive.
For a Ford starter, they are well under $20 (chinese ones are under $10). Lem has the OE Ford top quality ones.
I always carry a spare drive pinion...just in case...no matter what type of starter that I run.
I hope this helps...
Thanks,
Keith

Keith,

its just a reg distributor setup....msd probillet deal...i think its the intital timing setup, as it only does it when it fires up every once in a while....the starter is from Advance Auto with their lifetime warranty on it, so i will be replacing it today, actually in an hour or so....surprising thing is not even a scratch on the flywheel!
The momnet i get her to fire again, i am goin to advance the timing from 10 to 12degrees and see if that helps her a little....

Frank

Frank,
Yeah...you will probably end up with more inital (base) timing and then if needed, cut back the total mechanical in the distributor if it gets out of range.

I bet the warranty guy at Advance will get a frowny face when he looks at that toothless wonder!
Later...
Keith

...........and as stated check the rotor phase........

richter69 wrote:...........and as stated check the rotor phase........

I will if you explain what that means...seriously, this is ALL new to me first engine, first distrib, first carb for that matter....


the guy at advance looked at it, said that aint right , and got me another one in like 3 minutes.....granted i have to drive a mile to get it(not like thats a big deal)

to ckeck phase -- get a cap , drill hole between #1 plug tower and coil tower . with timing light , point at hole --rotor should be at/near the #1 post

in ten minutes we swapped out starters!!!!! BUT i guess we missed a small piece of the old starter gear...and of course that found its way into th enew starter when starting , and destroyed the new gear on the new starter instantly.....so much fun.....so back to advance tomorrow!

as for the timing, thankfully it started when it killed the gear, and when we bumped the timing she sounded sooo much better, but I am curious, either the timing light is off, or something is weird as it reads at 20 degrees....temp bumped to 180 constant, and the oil pressure which is usually at like 70-80 dropped to 40-45

sound kosher or no

And guys please feel free to dumb the info down for me.....pretend i have never ever done this before! Cause i havent....but i will say I did find a way to strip my car, build the motor, do all the electrical, suspension, cage, sheetmetal, ect myself! which i am proud of, but who knows if it is right or not! All i know is it works.....but please use simple english or explain any tech terms

fyi, if the above sounds sarcastic, it was not meant to at all....its just sometime when i get answers i have no clue what you more experienced guys are talking about....all i know is i want this thing to run right......


btw anyone have a rebuild sheet for a 1050 dominator- not the newr ones with the removable air bleeds, but the 9375 carb

frank13 wrote:in ten minutes we swapped out starters!!!!! BUT i guess we missed a small piece of the old starter gear...and of course that found its way into th enew starter when starting , and destroyed the new gear on the new starter instantly.....so much fun.....so back to advance tomorrow!

as for the timing, thankfully it started when it killed the gear, and when we bumped the timing she sounded sooo much better, but I am curious, either the timing light is off, or something is weird as it reads at 20 degrees....temp bumped to 180 constant, and the oil pressure which is usually at like 70-80 dropped to 40-45

sound kosher or no

And guys please feel free to dumb the info down for me.....pretend i have never ever done this before! Cause i havent....but i will say I did find a way to strip my car, build the motor, do all the electrical, suspension, cage, sheetmetal, ect myself! which i am proud of, but who knows if it is right or not! All i know is it works.....but please use simple english or explain any tech terms

Frank,don't feel bad.It's not a crime to ask a honest about something. Checking the phase is pretty simple though. Just drill the hole in the cap like Dan said,hook up the regular timing light wire (Clamp)to #1 cyl.and start the engine.When you pull the trigger have it pointed in the hole in the cap and it should be firing in the hole on #1.
the trigger

ok, so the flywheel is missing one tooth?! got 3 rd starter today....hopefully the missing tooth wont be too big of a problem

Your going to need a new flex plate
Frank

Frank Merkl wrote:Your going to need a new flex plate
Frank

its a manual frank, think i can get a couple monthes out of her....gotta pull it over the winter to rebuild anyways...

frank

Frank some fly wheels have removeable starter rings check and see if yourss does. if so you can get ahold of the manufacture and get a new Ring....



Randy

take the ring geag off , and take it to NAPA . to get off , just need a punch (large dull cold chisel works best) and hammer. hit the ring gear moving aroung the gear . to reinstall will need to heat the ring till it falls on flywheel . I'v got ring gear from NAPA for aluim.f/w's., manufactures must be useing oem rings

bbf-falcon wrote:

frank13 wrote:in ten minutes we swapped out starters!!!!! BUT i guess we missed a small piece of the old starter gear...and of course that found its way into th enew starter when starting , and destroyed the new gear on the new starter instantly.....so much fun.....so back to advance tomorrow!

as for the timing, thankfully it started when it killed the gear, and when we bumped the timing she sounded sooo much better, but I am curious, either the timing light is off, or something is weird as it reads at 20 degrees....temp bumped to 180 constant, and the oil pressure which is usually at like 70-80 dropped to 40-45

sound kosher or no

And guys please feel free to dumb the info down for me.....pretend i have never ever done this before! Cause i havent....but i will say I did find a way to strip my car, build the motor, do all the electrical, suspension, cage, sheetmetal, ect myself! which i am proud of, but who knows if it is right or not! All i know is it works.....but please use simple english or explain any tech terms

Frank,don't feel bad.It's not a crime to ask a honest about something. Checking the phase is pretty simple though. Just drill the hole in the cap like Dan said,hook up the regular timing light wire (Clamp)to #1 cyl.and start the engine.When you pull the trigger have it pointed in the hole in the cap and it should be firing in the hole on #1.
the trigger

not trying to high jack some one elses post but i put in a new 8577 msd distributor and my car starts very hard and does the whole back fire thing also could my distributor need rotor phased also or is that just for crank trigger diistributors...thanks

Crank Trigger dist's dont have any wire's coming from them,because the leads from the ign.box go down and connect to crk sensor instead of the dizzy.

fatal addiction wrote:

bbf-falcon wrote:

frank13 wrote:in ten minutes we swapped out starters!!!!! BUT i guess we missed a small piece of the old starter gear...and of course that found its way into th enew starter when starting , and destroyed the new gear on the new starter instantly.....so much fun.....so back to advance tomorrow!

as for the timing, thankfully it started when it killed the gear, and when we bumped the timing she sounded sooo much better, but I am curious, either the timing light is off, or something is weird as it reads at 20 degrees....temp bumped to 180 constant, and the oil pressure which is usually at like 70-80 dropped to 40-45

sound kosher or no

And guys please feel free to dumb the info down for me.....pretend i have never ever done this before! Cause i havent....but i will say I did find a way to strip my car, build the motor, do all the electrical, suspension, cage, sheetmetal, ect myself! which i am proud of, but who knows if it is right or not! All i know is it works.....but please use simple english or explain any tech terms

Frank,don't feel bad.It's not a crime to ask a honest about something. Checking the phase is pretty simple though. Just drill the hole in the cap like Dan said,hook up the regular timing light wire (Clamp)to #1 cyl.and start the engine.When you pull the trigger have it pointed in the hole in the cap and it should be firing in the hole on #1.
the trigger

not trying to high jack some one elses post but i put in a new 8577 msd distributor and my car starts very hard and does the whole back fire thing also could my distributor need rotor phased also or is that just for crank trigger diistributors...thanks

you need to check it, i had hard starting issues and put the starter saver on and it made it worse.........to the point of knocking out two drives. I checked the phase and it was way off.........had to slot the cap adapter where it bolts to the housing to get it right..........started perfect after that.

sorry guys i'm having a hard time understanding this but if i have 28* total timing and i slot the cap screw holes and phase my cap so the rotor is dead on the # 1 wire or terminal won't that change my timing all i know is i havent broke a starter yeaht but the way it's been starting it's going to happen really soon i can feel it...thanks eric

Frank we use to just heat the gear with a torch until it was loose enough to slide off.
Never had a broken tooth though. Always just flipped the gear over to get the starter on the unused area of the teeth.

mike

ok so here is a stupid question....i think the number 2 and 3 plug wires were switched when we changed plugs.....would that cause the backfire through the carb like i explained?

the rotor phase thing seems correct if i did it right...
timing is set to about 12 initial


only thing i think i realized is the plug wires for 2 and 3 cylnders MAY have been switched...i think they were my buddy thinks there were right...

its just getting annoying...anyone near the phila area wanna check it out?

Also I am rebuilding a 1050 dom carb to replace the edel 750 carb on it now......can someone please give me a good starting point to set it up....power valve or not, jetting, ect.....does not have adjustable airbleeds.......i cant find the stock settings for it, so a good street/strip starting point would be great......motor is a 30 over 10.5:1 pump gas,with pi heads, stealth, bypass reg, ect.

carb is a 9375-2....was intedned to be used as a dual carb setup, i want to use it for a single carb setup up

Yes crosswire can/will cause backfire. Another thing is I may be mistaken but I think the starter drive is different on a manual vs automatic. You say yours is a man. so make sure the starter is correct.

ok , so today

a. final wiring on the alt.....
b. triple checked the plug wires, which i swear had 2 and 3 swapped....
c. started car----NO BACK FIRE, IDLED PERFECT, HAD LOTS OF BALLS, SOUNDED INCREDIBLE.....HAS NOT SOUNDED THIS GOOD YET!


i truly think the biggest problem was the plug wires were switched, and the ignition was getting a good power source without the alt....i think the electric fan, igniton and the electric pump were draining the battery too fast......

starter worked fine. no issues at all tonight, even went back an hour later to start her again and she fired just as nice and idled just as smooth

SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO happy!

Dats

congratulations on getting it all worked out.