Re: PROCOMP HEADS ------ STICKY------

521fox4eye January 30th 2010, 4:04 pm

agreed,a lot of people worry to much about peak BIG flow numbers.they don't worry about low-mid lift flow,velocity etc etc.. my brother wasted his money on the chinese junk,the only benefit was the car lost some weight,but by the time he fixed all the cheap junk ie valve seats,guides and the horrible ports he had almost as much in them as he would have a quality proven cylinder head.theres a lot of opinions on here about the pro-cough heads,but from personal experience save the time and money and do it right the first time

richter69 January 30th 2010, 4:58 pm

Les must be tryin to slow his car down some.............. Laughing

rmcomprandy January 30th 2010, 7:39 pm

They certainly HAVE their position in the marketplace for only certain applications ... used anywhere else and they are a terrible deal.

dfree383 January 30th 2010, 8:00 pm

richter69 wrote:Les must be tryin to slow his car down some..............

what a F'n A Clown........ You know a good set of D3's would make that turd faster.

And being able to see over the steering wheel with out a booster seat and reaching the pedals would't hurt either......... Laughing

c.evans January 30th 2010, 8:15 pm

frank13 wrote:D0VE C filled with brass 230 max cfm 1.75" valve
Procomp raised very much like the TFS street. 251 max. 1.76 tuliped exhaust valve.
D3 with no floor fill but a bunch of port work. TFS cutter on seats. 1.8" exhaust valve. 214 cfm max.
Decent flowing P-51 research prototype. 1.76" tuliped valve 250 max cfm. Later P-51's max out at 262 cfm.
Out of the box SCJ casting.
Iron cj with typical mid 80's exhaust port work tweeked by RHP

Heads were flowed with 2" primary header pipe 4" straight off of the flange with one 90 degree bend vs the crites #8 primary for the 67 galaxie which abruptly turns down off of the flange and has a 50 degree bend.

Dove straight / crites..... P/C straight / crites....D3 straight / crites... P-51 straight / crites.. SCJ straight / crites... Iron cj straight / crites

.200" 116 / 114..............115 / 113..................107 / 106..........116 / 115...........102 / 101.....................104 / 103
.300" 156 / 150..............160 / 151..................145 / 145..........151 / 147...........139 / 136.....................142 / 140
.400" 184 / 176..............198 / 187..................176 / 174..........178 / 174...........164 / 160.....................169 / 165
.500" 205 / 192..............226 / 207..................201 / 196..........204 / 200...........184 / 182.....................189 / 184
.600" 217 / 204..............238 / 218..................213 / 209..........227 / 219...........197 / 192.....................200 / 194
.700" 224 / 209..............245 / 223..................214 / 211..........238 / 230...........207 / 199.....................207 / 200
.800" 230 / 213..............251 / 226..................214 / 210..........250 / 239...........211 / 204.....................210 / 204

So looking at this, why is the procomp getting such a bad rap......they outflowed everything else tested.....am i missing something......this is from mad prters post on exhaust stuff.....just a copy and past....

Yes Frank you are missing something. All of the above work that Scotty did, was a flow test of the exhaust ports only. You are missing the intake ports and their flow. That's the other half of the equation. If you ask the question which port is more important in regards to making horsepower, the answer is the intake ports. The intake flow of the Pro Comps suffers badly when compared to the other OEM and CJ style heads.

Hope this helps,
Uncle Charlie

richter69 January 30th 2010, 8:17 pm

The chamber is junk to.

The Mad Porter March 7th 2010, 5:42 pm

Agreed Charlie and Richter..

The procomp exhaust port is actually quite good when properly ported and only when properly ported.

The intake geometry and flow bias suck as cast and can be improved with careful reshaping of the intake port roof, guide trenches and short turn crest. I have managed 360 cfm and more.

The issue is still quality of intake flow and an absolutely terrible combustion chamber design.

A fully worked pair of p/c castings against a good but not max effort pair of not mine Doves was marginally faster with the reduced static c/r of the larger chamber. Add the additional power that the c/r would bring and they are still woefully short of the other aluminum offerings.

Very Happy

jc10000rpm March 9th 2010, 10:01 pm

so, is the compression chamber just to big, ??? or do you mean the shape of the chamber is bad ??

rmcomprandy March 10th 2010, 10:07 am

jc10000rpm wrote:so, is the compression chamber just to big, ??? or do you mean the shape of the chamber is bad ??

The chamber just LOOKS pretty awfull because it doesn't have a consistant circular outside shape to it; (like a bunch of connected short flat walls which doesn't adversely affect anything but is not very pleasing to the eye).

cooter July 1st 2010, 10:04 am

i have no experience with procomp ford heads but have seen horrible casting problems with chev smallblock heads. The chev blocks are no better either with problems in the main cap areas.

Maddmattmustangs July 28th 2010, 5:28 pm

Where's the procomp hero Jeremiah? Laughing

richter69 July 28th 2010, 6:14 pm

Maddmattmustangs wrote:Where's the procomp hero Jeremiah?

You cant use ProComp and HeRo in the same paragraph.............

bb429power July 28th 2010, 6:20 pm

richter69 wrote:
Maddmattmustangs wrote:Where's the procomp hero Jeremiah?

You cant use ProComp and HeRo in the same paragraph.............

procrap ZeRo

Maddmattmustangs July 28th 2010, 6:59 pm

richter69 wrote:
Maddmattmustangs wrote:Where's the procomp hero Jeremiah?

You cant use ProComp and HeRo in the same paragraph.............

My bad

bruno July 28th 2010, 9:08 pm

come on guys lets keep this as technical a possible

thxs
Nick Bruno

richter69 July 28th 2010, 10:58 pm

bruno wrote:come on guys lets keep this as technical a possible

thxs
Nick Bruno

aint much technical in a procomp product..........

Maddmattmustangs July 29th 2010, 10:08 am

richter69 wrote:
bruno wrote:come on guys lets keep this as technical a possible

thxs
Nick Bruno

aint much technical in a procomp product..........

I've heard that on there bare castings the valve guides need honing or complete re machining in most instances. Also the valve seats are recessed far into the port messing with the short turn.

Valves in there assembled heads tend to have wide variations in stem diameter. Widest I've heard of being .060 over what's promoted. The bronze they use also has proven to be weaker than the standard.

rmcomprandy July 31st 2010, 11:06 am

Maddmattmustangs wrote:
richter69 wrote:
bruno wrote:come on guys lets keep this as technical a possible

thxs
Nick Bruno

aint much technical in a procomp product..........

I've heard that on there bare castings the valve guides need honing or complete re machining in most instances. Also the valve seats are recessed far into the port messing with the short turn.

Valves in there assembled heads tend to have wide variations in stem diameter. Widest I've heard of being .060 over what's promoted. The bronze they use also has proven to be weaker than the standard.

Getting the ASSEMBLED heads directly from ProComp is certainly not a good idea.
If anything, the seats are to tall in a BARE casting because a valve job is NOT done to them and that makes for GOOD reshaping possibilities. AND, there are NO valves in a BARE casting.
"Proven" bad bronze...??? I haven't seen it in the over 50 pair I've finished with good hardware. Having bad guide clearance set-up will eat-up anybodies bronze guides.

The "I've heard", my "buddy told me" and a "friend of a friend knows", shouldn't be construed as GOOD information; What you have actually witnessed and done yourself is all that should be discussed here.

jones November 8th 2010, 6:18 pm

Has anyone come up with a CNC program to correct the flaws in the chambers and ports?

richter69 November 8th 2010, 6:23 pm

when the CNC program can add material it might be possible............... Very Happy

jones November 8th 2010, 8:48 pm

Just a question.

Could you mill the deck down just enough to reshape the chambers? I guess that would just add to the cost and not make budget sense for someone to do.

Lem Evans November 8th 2010, 8:59 pm

jones wrote:Has anyone come up with a CNC program to correct the flaws in the chambers and ports?

One can NOT CNC what is not there Wink

rmcomprandy July 27th 2011, 12:39 pm

I am going to equate this to small block Ford ProComp heads because that is where I can share actual CNC experiences.

I am a ProComp dealer and also a RHS dealer. Bare ProComp heads are about $500.00 less money per pair than the RHS.
The cheap A$$ street wienies just don't wish to pay the extra money for the better flowing, fitting, "out of the box" RHS head. Almost every one who walks through the door wanted to know if he could have the ProComp heads CNC'd and get a better flowing head in the end.
You simply can't talk sense to the 20 some year old who knows everything and has little money to spend.
To make a long story short ... I developed a CNC program for the 195cc ProComp heads.
Those idiots buy, the ProComp head and pay the extra $700.00 for the CNC work. I only work with bare heads in either case so the other parts and charges are the same.

The ProComp head now flows good, (not great), air but, for near the same amount of money outlay an RHS head of the same finished port size with hand "bowl porting" could have been had with only about 10% less maximum airflow; actually better down low.
However, now those customers can tell everyone they have CNC'd heads, as that is the major BUZZ word with the uninformed high performance enthusiast and they can all rave about what a good deal he got.

I have done a bunch of 'em and trying to talk sense to them just goes in one ear and out the other.

pistons November 28th 2013, 2:33 pm

All aluminum heads have to be worked to out flow cast iron ported dove c heads. with out the port work as you say it's just a chunk of aluminum. For a street strip head they are great! For a race head they are great! I'd rather have a set of heads that are seat and valve Simi ready to run. Benefits are almost any valve job you decide to have done will not sink the valves into the heads. A good four angle valve job and a light hand blending of both intake and exhaust ports + smoothing out the short turn radius intake and exhaust without changing the factory radius. Most all super stock and pro stock heads come the same way as the pro comp heads do. For a street 460 ci. motor with from 425 to 500 hp only need a clean up of ports and a good valve job. The as cast exhaust flow will exceed 500 HP no problem. Like we say what are you looking for and how much power do you need? Why have a set of heads that flow enough air to run 700 + hp when you are using it on the street with mufflers and a restrictive air filter. One should only look at how much HP is your goal? and only spend the money to reach that goal. You go the other route and kill bottom and mid range torque because heads were massaged to flow enough air to support 800 or so HP?

QtrWarrior November 28th 2013, 3:34 pm

pistons wrote:All aluminum heads have to be worked to out flow cast iron ported dove c heads. with out the port work as you say it's just a chunk of aluminum. For a street strip head they are great! For a race head they are great! I'd rather have a set of heads that are seat and valve Simi ready to run. Benefits are almost any valve job you decide to have done will not sink the valves into the heads. A good four angle valve job and a light hand blending of both intake and exhaust ports + smoothing out the short turn radius intake and exhaust without changing the factory radius. Most all super stock and pro stock heads come the same way as the pro comp heads do. For a street 460 ci. motor with from 425 to 500 hp only need a clean up of ports and a good valve job. The as cast exhaust flow will exceed 500 HP no problem. Like we say what are you looking for and how much power do you need? Why have a set of heads that flow enough air to run 700 + hp when you are using it on the street with mufflers and a restrictive air filter. One should only look at how much HP is your goal? and only spend the money to reach that goal. You go the other route and kill bottom and mid range torque because heads were massaged to flow enough air to support 800 or so HP?

Sorry, But that is not right... Not ALL aluminum heads have to be ported to outflow ported DOVE-C heads...Some alum heads do as good or even better straight out of the box....

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