Uh oh.....break-in gone bad??

After what I thought was a stellar cam break in, I changed oil and tidied up some wires in preparation for my pending burnouts. Well, things went downhill fast. I tried to start the truck yesterday, but it would idle very good - lots of popping through the carb, and some in the exhaust. I had the timing around 10° BTC, but it didn't seem to change much anywhere I put the distributor. So, I pull the valve covers off, and several of the rockers have LOTS of slop (the rocker nuts are tight - positive stop rail rockers). I pull all the plugs to ease turning the engine over, but it's HARD to turn over. WAY harder than pre-break in. Maybe that's why it stopped so abruptly after my 20 minute cam break in? I can't see NOT pulling the engine at this point, unless you guys have a miracle cure in your back pocket. Mid-October with NO money left in the budget is not a great time to be starting over on a plow truck engine. I hoped it was a bad dream I was having, but it didn't get any better by itself this morning.

Any thoughts?

Pete

Sorry, Having some of my luck now. Might as well jerk it

The exact same symptoms mine had apart from the hard to turn over part. Only way to find out is pull the intake and have a peek. That's when my worst fears were confirmed. On the rebuild I used Joe Gibbs BR and all went really well.

Cut the oil filter open, that will tell the tale.

Though this was a low-buck deal, I really didn't cut any corners. I spent WAY more money than I should have on this ol' truck. It's hard to muster up the motivation to do ANYTHING right now. It took so long to get to this point. I'm seriously considering pushing this heap tp the curb with a For Sale sign on it. It would have taken about 2 months of trouble free smokey burnouts to pay back the time and frustration of this summer. I'll Sawzall the filter open (only way I have.....I'll try to disregard the chips from the blade) and pull the RPM off. I wish I could pay the 17 year old version of myself to come make this thing run. Hell, that guy would work all night for free, just to prove a point. It sucks to grow up and be fat and lazy.

Can't SAWSALL it You will have lots /Lots of metal shavings that you know where come from

Intake is off. Cam is gone. At least two lifters are mushed over, and looks like another two lobes of the cam are scuffed. So much for all that EOS and VR1!!

So, if I get enough gumption to not set the garage on fire and call this whole thing done, I can HOPEFULLY get a new cam from Comp (well, Summit, I guess). But how could I better prepare for break in? $50 worth of EOS, and 4 quarts of Valvoline's good stuff weren't enough. Rubbing a rabbit's foot like a paint shaker at Home Depot wasn't good enough either. How the $%^& is a guy supposed to break in a cam???? I can't believe I gotta pull the engine again. As they said in "Airplane!".......Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffin' glue.....

There's a place that you can send your cam to and they will brake it in for you, about $50-75, and one of the guys that work there are on here sometimes and the other 460 site. I think thats a good investment.
sorry I cant remember he's name

As they said in "Airplane!".......Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffin' glue.....

Classic!!!

Cam break in service may be a good investment.

Do you have single or double valve springs?

Single, wimpy stock springs. This was going to be a low rpm plow truck (the Performer RPM was a leftover from my glory days of Galaxies and other money wasting objects of my affection). The cam was a X4262, maybe a bit snotty for its intended usage, but I figured I'd rather have a little more rumpety-rump than a steaight-laced stocker. In hindsight, think of how little sleep I would have lost, not needing to break in a new cam......and it woulda ran JUST fine. Damn. I am seriously upset about all this. Maybe that break in service would be a good idea. After all, $75 is a LOT less than pulling the engine, waiting for the warranty guy to give his blessing, new gaskerts, tear the WHOLE CRAPPY thing down, new bearings, rings?? Ugh....... Anyone got a turn key engine ready to go?

you could always go with a roller if you decide to put it back together, no wiping out cam issues, just lots of valvetrain preventive maintenance

Galaxie427 wrote:Anyone got a turn key engine ready to go?

Doug, (1bad521) does, but I don't think you want a full blow drag motor in a plow truck.

Sorry to hear that man.

I can't imagine what would have went wrong with stock springs, EOS and VR1. May have just been a dud. BUT you still get stuck with the tear-down and labor even if they warrenty the cam.

Bill

These are the guys: http://www.camresearchcorp.com/

Since I'm still running slushsticks for now I'm gonna enlist their services soon

The breakin from cam research is not a full break in you still have to go thru a shortened breakin procedure. I wont pay for it again.

lghting94 wrote:The breakin from cam research is not a full break in you still have to go thru a shortened breakin procedure. I wont pay for it again.

Details? Is it not what it's cracked up to be?

I ordered a custom vacuum specific cam from them and paid for the breakin got the cam and recieved with the cam a note saying I still needed to do a short breakin period. I believe it was either 10 or 15 minutes at 2000 rpm or higher using valvoline 20w50 vr1 oil. I did this and still lost the cam by mid season. I will say the cam did as they said it would peak rpm, approx HP, and the exact vacuum I needed.

I feel your pain.
For my second rebuild I used Joe Gibbs assembly grease and Joe Gibbs BR. My engine machinist recommended them. He has an excellent reputation and has built engines for Le Mans and similar. He was losing a lot of flat tappet cams (many were FE's) until he went over to J.G. oil. He loses none now and even said that he has broke in with dual springs and been ok (not customers engines!).

It's pretty sad that we did'nt have this much trouble w/cams years ago

bbf-falcon wrote:It's pretty sad that we did'nt have this much trouble w/cams years ago

No kidding. I am scared to even buy a flat tapped cam now. That is just screwed up.

Galaxie427 wrote:Anyone got a turn key engine ready to go?

Broken-in, dyno'd, ready to ship. Click the link below for details.

http://www.carsbycarl.com/Specials.html

i wish so much i could help you guys, i must be one of the lucky ones? never hurt a cam,
crane,isky,comp,bullit,and others,most we ever did was bend pushrods back in the 70s early 80s, now using comp pushrods,and smith bro in big stuff no more problems for that either,

one thing i dont do is use a break in oil, what ever weight the engine will see for duty is what i start with,,i have NEVER soaked the lifters, coat them yes,and cam,and i prelube the engine JUST before startup, run for a while at different(1500 to 3000) rpms,warm it up,shut it off, and do it again,total for about 30 40min's,then one last time start and let it idle as im checking everything over,thats it. the next time i start it i drive it,and not easy either.

-rich

Galaxie427 wrote:Single, wimpy stock springs. This was going to be a low rpm plow truck (the Performer RPM was a leftover from my glory days of Galaxies and other money wasting objects of my affection). The cam was a X4262, maybe a bit snotty for its intended usage, but I figured I'd rather have a little more rumpety-rump than a steaight-laced stocker. In hindsight, think of how little sleep I would have lost, not needing to break in a new cam......and it woulda ran JUST fine. Damn. I am seriously upset about all this. Maybe that break in service would be a good idea. After all, $75 is a LOT less than pulling the engine, waiting for the warranty guy to give his blessing, new gaskerts, tear the WHOLE CRAPPY thing down, new bearings, rings?? Ugh....... Anyone got a turn key engine ready to go?

I am not familiar with this cam. Is it possible that you had coil bind or guide to retainer interference? How much lift does this cam have?

The one time I lost a cam on initial break in, I went through all the things you are doing. Cursing the cam designer, their quality control procedures, the cam guru who recommended them to me, the integrity of their mothers marital status at the time of conception, etc. I even sent the cam back to the company (not comp) for their engineers to analysis for a while, and surprise surprise, they said it was not their fault,... never is.

Its spooky to think that all the metal is in your new engine, but don't walk away from it, or go though the costs of modifying the heads. Go through it again, and if you are still a little gun shy, contact MPG heads in Colorado. They will break in your cam on the "Cam King" for around 100 bucks for you, and send you the lifters in order and all that. I had a good experience with them and gave me enough confidence to try it again. That cam from them is a pretty radical grind, flat tappet, and been driven on the street and strip for 12 years now. No complaints.

Good luck.

Been there. Got the T shirt

Rockers hit the valvecover baffles. I did a half assed job checking clearance.
Tore it apart, paid for all new machining (Bypass opened and dumped metal all over).
Paid for the cam re-install and crank, put the pistons in and assembled to a point.
Got sick came back 7 days later and the lifter bores were full of rust

Tore it all down, used gibbs and a scotch bright pad and cleaned it all up and reassembled.
Successfully broke in the cam

Totalled the car

Put the mill in a new car
Then I discovered I had tapped the cam plug in too far and the cam gear/timing chain ate the cover.
Drove the clattering mess to an hour to Detroit at 100mph and had my buddy redo it completely and drove it back.

A month later the tranny cooler burst in the radiator and filled the mill with
pink goo and wasted my newly rebuilt C6 by filling it with pink coolant.

This summer I paid a guy to rebuild the trac lock. He F'd it up and it sat all summer.

Is it worth it?

You tell me:



Some days I'm not sure myself but it sure is pretty.
Heck, I can't believe these guys still respond to my posts

Good luck man. You get to be teflon to this stuff or you give up.
if you're a car guy you can't help but do it over.