460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

KKaiser November 9th 2019, 12:45 pm

As predicted, I just go the mark iv in yesterday, and the car has a hard starting issue. if its left to sit for couple hours, it has a hard time starting. the starter turns the engine over just fine.. its as if not getting enough fuel. as i turn it over,, it just turns over, pumping gas pedal, it almost starts, but cant quite get there, after maybe 6 or so times, it starts on up,, and, after running a few minutes, or short drive, it will start up fine once its going. however, if i let it sit again a couple hours, it will be hard to start,, the longer it sits, the more times turns of the key to get it going..

history, i know it was one family car, stored inside, was driving probably every week up till 5 years ago when the owner died. his estate just took it out now and again after that, but very little,, Engine has 59k miles,,

only thing i cant find working is the windshield wipers,, washer works, wipers wont turn on, antenna works, light roll up nicely, 8 track works!! gotta find some old tapes, i guess,,

so, initially,, anythougnt on the engine start,, ?
any thought on first place to look for wipers. ?

Sincerely Kim

jpierce55 November 9th 2019, 1:09 pm

Does it smoke ar start up?

KKaiser November 9th 2019, 2:04 pm

nope,,,,,

i did at least find out problem on the wipers,, they weren't hooked up,, looks t have a new motor, but the wiper is not on the splined part, they were just sitting there and the spline was spinning,, i set them on but either the wiper inside is stripped or the spine that rotates is stripped, so at lest i know what that is,, just have to figure out solution.. washer works thought, water comes out of the hose,,,

i know this isn't a lincoln forum, but have to think a lot of this is interchangeable to tbirds of the day, and other parts

BBFTorino November 9th 2019, 2:45 pm

Check or replace the fuel filter and check any rubber fuel lines for dry cracks, leaking etc.

KKaiser November 9th 2019, 2:55 pm

yes, that was part of the plan just to get things up to present, plugs,, wires,, re set timing,,
the engine is remarkably clean,, there is a light valley pan leak,,but other than that it looks good,

it doesnt look like its a foam cleaned engine ,, it just looks clean,, i guess only 59k miles makes a difference in wear,,,

The Mad Porter November 9th 2019, 10:16 pm

The motorcraft 4350 carb is a PIA.

Make sure you have accel pump shot. This fails often.

SJ
used 2b RHP

Very Happy

KKaiser November 9th 2019, 10:29 pm

i did some reading on that last night,, some guy said he spent 350 or so rebuilding several time,, finally gave up, it was in his truck,, he opted for a new carb, something warrier,, maybe holley,, dont remember the you tube,,,

im not against spending 350 or so on a new carb and not fight constant tuneing an problems on an old one.as long as its pretty much plug and play, i dont have easy access to machining, etc. so if anyone has a good option out there, let me know,

The Mad Porter November 10th 2019, 2:48 pm

KKaiser wrote:i did some reading on that last night,, some guy said he spent 350 or so rebuilding several time,, finally gave up, it was in his truck,, he opted for a new carb, something warrier,, maybe holley,, dont remember the you tube,,,

im not against spending 350 or so on a new carb and not fight constant tuneing an problems on an old one.as long as its pretty much plug and play, i dont have easy access to machining, etc. so if anyone has a good option out there, let me know,

Here's the rub.

The spread bore carb and intake utilize the 4150 bolt pattern.
While a std carb will bolt up the butterflies will not open properly.

Solutions:

Carb adapter from TD.
Holley 600 with ford kick down.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/trd-2199?seid=srese1&gclid=CjwKCAiAh5_uBRA5EiwASW3IaqffwP57DY-TBLsvIudPgiexJlcGpptGLU22lXLZAUQCeiMaWKHAQRoCrrYQAvD_BwE

Older square bore intake or an eddy performer with the heat cross over blocked.

On an OEM 1976 engine:

Use a straight up timing set to advance cam timing 8* to early straight up
Properly curve the distributor and hook up vacuum advance to ported vacuum eliminate the vacuum temp switches and break.

When disabling EGR you MUST take vacuum advance out of the distributor. Lessen not eliminate.

This and a simple dual exhaust with h pipe will significantly improve driveability and grunt. Getting 5100 pounds moving from a dead stop with 2.75 gears and 7.7 to 1 static c/r requires all of the low end grunt you can get.

SJ
used 2b RHP

Very Happy

KKaiser November 10th 2019, 3:02 pm

ok,, thinking back on my 63 cadd, w rochester,, in the morning, the blade is closed to about an 1/8th, it starts almost immediately and blade opens.

i looked under the air cleaner, (its about 35outiside) and the motocraft carb has a re built tag on it.. and the blade was almost 1/2 open,, it has an electric choke.. i did a quick check on tube to see how to get that blade down and so i undid the three screws, and turned it counter clockwise, but it didnt move at all while i watched it. so i went in to start to see what happens, and when i came to look, it was down to about one eight closed. the car seemed, now i say seemed to start a little quicker,

i stand corrected on another commenter, yes, white smoke came out, and for a while, but after a short ride, it was g0one,,

i did notice however, at idle, its running rougher after warmup, it didnt do that before i started fooling with it.. also, i noticed, if i was going slow, and gave it a hard acceleration, there is a hesitation, dont think i noticed that either,

so, there you have it,, any thoughts on that,,,,did i turn too far,

The Mad Porter November 10th 2019, 3:15 pm

KKaiser wrote:ok,, thinking back on my 63 cadd, w rochester,, in the morning, the blade is closed to about an 1/8th, it starts almost immediately and blade opens.

i looked under the air cleaner, (its about 35outiside) and the motocraft carb has a re built tag on it.. and the blade was almost 1/2 open,, it has an electric choke.. i did a quick check on tube to see how to get that blade down and so i undid the three screws, and turned it counter clockwise, but it didnt move at all while i watched it. so i went in to start to see what happens, and when i came to look, it was down to about one eight closed. the car seemed, now i say seemed to start a little quicker,

i stand corrected on another commenter, yes, white smoke came out, and for a while, but after a short ride, it was g0one,,

i did notice however, at idle, its running rougher after warmup, it didnt do that before i started fooling with it.. also, i noticed, if i was going slow, and gave it a hard acceleration, there is a hesitation, dont think i noticed that either,

so, there you have it,, any thoughts on that,,,,did i turn too far,

In low temps you have to set the choke by hitting the throttle a couple of times.

make SURE you have accelerator pump shot.

A bit of white smoke is normal at start up.

Adjust the choke spring housing so that when cold the butterfly just closes. Too much tension and it will not fully open.
When warm make sure it is fully open and off of the fast idle cam.

SJ
used 2b RHP

Very Happy

KKaiser November 10th 2019, 3:36 pm

Hey, thanks for that set up info in the morning,,

could you please elaborate on this statement

"make SURE you have accelerator pump shot'

Remember, i am a novice, so i need some addl clarification

thanks again.

69F100 November 10th 2019, 8:24 pm

KKaiser wrote:Hey, thanks for that set up info in the morning,,

could you please elaborate on this statement

"make SURE you have accelerator pump shot'

With the engine shut off take the air cleaner off and look over in the carb and open the troddle and see if you see any gas shooting in the carb if you do the pump is working if you do not see any gas then the pump need to change

Remember, i am a novice, so i need some addl clarification

thanks again.

KKaiser November 10th 2019, 8:55 pm

thats what I thought but wanted to be sure,,

thanks again,,

KKaiser November 11th 2019, 12:21 pm

this morning,,, about 12 out,, i hit the gas pedal to engage the choke,,, it popped down to almost closed which i was glad to see,

as suggested, i got a mirror, and reflected down in the bowl,, pushed on the throttle, and a small squirt popped out, it shot up and hit the mirror which i held just over the top of the carb blade , maybe about a drop. however, its doesnt happen every time i hit the throttle, i dont know if thats right or not, but lack of experience is my enemy,, anyway, i tried to start it,, it just turned over and over, without any feeling it was slowly coming around as in days past, so i left it,, i went back to test the throttle later and see if i got any fuel, and again,a little bubbled out, tired to start,, no indication it would start,,

i did notice some seepage of fuel, around the gasket on back driver side of the carburetor,, its just a little wet look, not dripping or anything, but the gasket is shiny,

anyway,, what is the next step, or do we already know whats up here,,

thanks for any thoughts...

69F100 November 11th 2019, 11:07 pm

It should be shooting everytime sounds like you need a carb rebuild or a new carb

KKaiser November 11th 2019, 11:39 pm

i did put about a spoon full or so of gas in the carb, and it started up and stayed running, took for about 40 mile ride with no hesitations, or what ever,,,

The Mad Porter November 12th 2019, 2:30 pm

It appears it is time to replace the carb

SJ
used 2b RHP

Very Happy

Calypso November 12th 2019, 2:50 pm

Many of 4300 style carbs I’ve messed with have leather accelerator pump piston which dries out, when the car is standing. Replacing it with aftermarket rubber style helps a lot.

KKaiser November 12th 2019, 5:36 pm

two more questions, would a couple shots of carb cleaner in the bowl and that little hole possible clean out anything that may be holding it up,

and

how can i find out what transmission I have on this vehicle.. the reason being,, as to whether i have to order additional accessories to make it fit the engine, in the event i decide to replace the thing.

I dont have an owners manual, but have a service manual on the way.

the base car is a 1976, lincoln mark IV w 460 engine.. is there a tag or something somewhere that would identify it??

The Mad Porter November 12th 2019, 5:51 pm

KKaiser wrote:two more questions, would a couple shots of carb cleaner in the bowl and that little hole possible clean out anything that may be holding it up,

and

how can i find out what transmission I have on this vehicle.. the reason being,, as to whether i have to order additional accessories to make it fit the engine, in the event i decide to replace the thing.

I dont have an owners manual, but have a service manual on the way.

the base car is a 1976, lincoln mark IV w 460 engine.. is there a tag or something somewhere that would identify it??

Transmission is a C6

The 4350 carbs are known to have accel pump isues. Not likely the squirters are plugged.

SJ
used 2b RHP

Very Happy

KKaiser November 12th 2019, 6:07 pm

thanks,,

kaiser April 3rd 2020, 9:28 pm

i started this thread back in NOV,, just got the new carb,, this is a little lengthy but here goes,,,

when i got back to the car, i got a service manual library. i tried to start but it wouldnt, it would turn, but not fire,, so i put a shot of engine starter in and it fired up,, ran it a little while, shut it down,
next day, same thing,, BUT, the engine light came on for about 5 minutes while idling, ran pretty rough, engine was vibration but eventually turned off, and engine quite vibrating, took for ride, and it seemed ok.

anyway, did that coupe times, same result,,

got the holley streetlighter wth an adapter,, to replace, well, lot more hose attachment on the motocraft than the holley,
the big vacuum in the back matched up, the front one that hooked to distributor i got hooke in, and one more that i hooked on front underside of the carb.

there was still one more hose that was a bit bigger, that ran to a white looking box under the blower box on the passenger side. I am only guessing it goes to the additional bigger outlet on the front of the carb., but the hose is a little too small, but its bigger than the distributor hose.

there was one metal tube that comes out of the intake, that attached to the choke, but the new carb doesnt have that, its electric,, DO i just block that off??
Secondly, there is another metal tube that comes out of intake, right next to the first metal tube, and it attached to the back of the old carb, there was a vacuum type attachment on the old carb not on the new one,, holley said it was a hot air hose,, so what do i do with that one..

Anyway, i guess i need to add a attachment for tramsnmssion kick down, even though holley originally said i didnt. but i hooked up gas lines and the three vacuum hoses i knew of , and it started right up...on the first try, the engine light didnt even come on, second time, it did, stayed on a while, then turned off,, engine running rought, shaking the block,,

SO,, any idea on the hoses and what to do with them that not enough outlets are there for, and any thoughts on the rough warmup

also, the old carb, on the bak there is a square hole that had large bunch of carmelly like gunk in the bottom of is about 2 inches thick,, yucky gunky stuff.. i dont see a hole or inlet so dont know what it does or where that came from, but it was really nasty

69F100 April 4th 2020, 6:47 pm

Plug the other hoses you didn't use. If one of them is pulling vacuum it will make it run ruff when it warms up.

kaiser April 4th 2020, 7:20 pm

thanks for that info... today, so that i didnt have to be long winded, i would just post a video of the hoses. located here https://youtu.be/TeDFvWvm2qY

secondly, the car is making a high pitched noise that it wasnt making ,, I'm not sure if its setup related or something else has come up, so please, take a look, and any tips, part IDs or anything you can contribute would be greatly appreciated you can find the noise video here.......https://youtu.be/0w2mYrSL_Z4

both only like a minute and change long,, again, any thoughts would be appreciated

69F100 April 5th 2020, 5:17 am

the big hose that runs in under the blower motor is to run the heater/ac controls it will need to be hook to the vacuum tree on the intake behind the carb. the vacuum to the distributer needs to hooked up to the side of the carb take the hose to the distributer off the tee hose. then plug the little hose in the video that is open it will cause a vacuum leak. you may have to pick up a tee to get the big hose hooked into the vacuum tee behind the carb.

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460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

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Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv

Re: 460 1976 Lincoln Mark iv