Project Cheap Skate - Revision 1

wont be a dyno sheet, I'll start a thread though. I have nearly every part I need and only have 75 dollars cash in it, all the other stuff I had lying around from previous builds or traded for....... lotsa tradin'..........

this one would have been a lot cheaper if I didn't count any value for stuff I had laying around.

I made some really good trades........

some items were multi trades......

richter69 wrote:I made some really good trades........

some items were multi trades......

Yes but you still have something in the traded parts, everything isn't free.

You need to dyno it.

true, I'll try and sit down and put a dollar figure on it, even at that it wont be much......


just have to see on the dyno if the funds are there, it may be this summer before it goes totgether, I have a small project I'm working on now and the sbf deal has to get done first.

Dave what did it finaly cost you on this build looks like I will have about $5500 in my 552 700 to 750 hp with new parts except roller cam in the short block and used A429 heads and eddy intake and used 1150

About $4,000

I'll come in well under half that..............

Cool, Get a thread started I'm interested in seeing how it all goes together.

Then..... Do a Burn Out with it !!

i will....... it will be set up for a bottle too........


just an old 64 swb parts chaser/ burger getter.......fun for the whole family....... hell i might drive it to tvrp and run true street w it.............track dyno.

Bump

Well I sold the top end off Cheap skate quite a few months back and now I'm going to redo it (again) and put it in my 1983 Mustang racecar.

Here's the new plan.

1) Install a new and more appropriate Cam Research Roller.... Specs 268-274 .783-.783 on a 108
2) New Lifters and a Double pinned timing set.
3) New set of 1.8 rockers.
4) Install a set of Ported Iron CJ heads with some New Lunati 74740 springs and TI retainers. The heads flowed around 370.
5) D&D 2 1/8" fox swap headers
6) New 1.80 Reid case glide and Convertor.
7) Race till it drops !

Compression is going to be down a bit to about 11.5:1 and flow is down around 20 cfm less, but with the revised camshaft, I'm expecting it to peak at about 400-500 RPM more and it should make about the same power. Opinions?

Should be together in a few months, I'm waiting on the cam to be ground and need to clear out a few things from my garage.

What's the EMC 572 going in?

Haven't decided yet, its sitting in Oakleys shop collecting dust.

dfree383 wrote:Well I sold the top end off Cheap skate quite a few months back and now I'm going to redo it (again) and put it in my 1983 Mustang racecar.

Here's the new plan.

1) Install a new and more appropriate Cam Research Roller.... Specs 268-274 .783-.783 on a 108
2) New Lifters and a Double pinned timing set.
3) New set of 1.8 rockers.
4) Install a set of Ported Iron CJ heads with some New Lunati 74740 springs and TI retainers. The heads flowed around 370.
5) D&D @ 1/8" fox swap headers
6) New 1.80 Reid case glide and Convertor.
7) Race till it drops !

Compression is going to be down a bit to about 11.5:1 and flow is down around 20 cfm less, but with the revised camshaft, I'm expecting it to peak at about 400-500 RPM more and it should make about the same power. Opinions?

Should be together in a few months, I'm waiting on the cam to be ground and need to clear out a few things from my garage.

1/8" headers is really going to choke that motor.  

Jess

Whoops.... Dat be 2 1/8"....

Cam and lifters showed up.....

Have you ever got the engine and car together

Ended up selling the car to my buddy. The engine has all the pieces, just haven't put it together.

Been working on the Dragster and Stock Eliminator stuff lately.

What lifters are those? Cam research house brand? What are your thoughts on them?

BigBlockRanger wrote:What lifters are those? Cam research house brand?  What are your thoughts on them?

Yes they are his house brand, they look good, I'd definitely say the are at least on par with the regular comp cams stuff and are made in the USA.

As far as service live, don't know haven't ran them yet.

They look similar to the stuff Herbert sells.

dfree383 wrote:Hears what the heads ended up flowing. As you can see a quality performance valve job is worth its weight in gold, I have not touched the intake ports except for the valve job. The valve job that was on these appeared to have only 2 angles and a sharp ridge, but the portwork itself looked rather nice. Lesson here is you get what you pay for in a valve job cost of the valve job $225

it should also be noted the intake valves on the befor did not have a backcut and the after numbers java a light backcut Nd that is also contributing to the excelent intake flows.

intake before valve job / after valve job.

.100 75 / 75
.200 143 / 169
.300 221 / 260
.400 293 / 319
.500 325 / 360
.600 349 / 384
.650 356 / 388
.700 358 / 391

exhaust before, after number are affected by a big ridge that need to be blended out, I'll post numbers after I get after them as the after numbers with the ridge where about the same as before. I expect improvements into the low 200's after I finish blending them.

.100 55
.200 119
.300 167
.400 186
.500 186
.600 188
.700 190

1.What are the better numbers out of the Aluminum SCJ's you have seen?

2.Comp. XR292's still gone?

https://www.compcams.com/xtreme-energy-254-260-solid-roller-cam-for-ford-429-460.html

3.^If so what is the closest shelf grind would you use now?

4. How much HP would you estimate to pick up with the same prep. work on the SCJ's?

I was kind of comparing this with that Tony's build and the numbers. I suspect that one had decent head prep (porting) not mentioned and maybe a few other S/S and Pull truck tricks inside (Ringer) since he claimed to do those at his shop and it was his track pet.? With his better heads and his cam maybe not.?

I had not seen this build and it is not that far off from what I planned if I ever go SCJ and Roller.

Thanks

dfree383 wrote:Dyno Results

5000 604.1 575.1
5100 607.5 589.9
5200 605.1 599.1
5300 600.1 605.6
5400 595.3 612.1
5500 585.0 612.7
5600 586.2 625.0
5700 584.1 633.9
5800 548.2 645.1
5900 583.3 655.3
6000 280.9 663.7
6100 574.7 667.5
6200 568.1 670.7
6300 561.8 673.9
6400 555.2 676.6
6500 547.0 676.9
6600 539.9 678.4
6700 534.1 681.3
6800 534.1 678.5
6900 512.2 672.9
7000 495.1 659.9

Specs on the motor

1050 Dominator
Ford Racing 4500 Victor Intake
Ported A429 heads (Heavily Cut to 62cc)
Comp Cams XR292 Roller
Flat Tops about 12.5:1 Compression
Stock 460 Cast Crank, Scat H beams
.030 Over D1VE block
Canton Fox Pan and Windage Tray
2" Sheonfeld Dyno Headers

I quoted the Specs/Dyno numbers so others would not have to hunt them down. Keep in mind this is a 12 year old thread and parts have gone up a tad both new and used.

PS: This one is .030" and ended up 466 also like Tony's build I mentioned in the previous post and is at the top of the Engine Tech Forum I bumped a couple of days ago. 466 750HP 6,300 to 6,600 RPM 9 sec.-ride.

https://www.429-460.com/t28731-6300-6600rpm-466-9sec-ride

https://www.429-460.com/t23410-466-aluminum-scj-cylinder-heads

They are a couple of good 466/472 budget builds with numbers to compare I thought, Thanks Doug for mentioning it, kinda of, No Tunnel Ram Numbers, is the one he brought up, I was looking for.?

Some more compression and cam this one would be well over 700…. Plus P51’s would get you a tick more too….

The one I did with my home made tunnel ram did 800 with home ported eddys

Thanks DFree. Maybe I will find the 800HP deal someday, I would like to check that one out to.

The 681HP at 6,700 Rpm is nice.

Just speculation on my part, Tony's build had a 108 LSA and installed at a 104 ICL ie installed at 4 degree's advance per his build sheet.
It (Tony's Cam) also has about 20 degree's more duration and quite a bit more lift than your XR292 roller. The XR292 Roller has a 110 LSA. I did not notice what it was installed at as far as advance/retard.?

I think that is why the HP peaked about 300-400 Rpm less ie 6,300-6,400Rpm on Tony's Build. Sure there are other factors involved, it is just an observation, is all. If anyone wants to compare the cams they are in the build sheet linked below and the Comp link if you scroll down on it.

I would think something closer to the XR292 roller would be easier on lifters for a street deal.


https://www.compcams.com/xtreme-energy-254-260-solid-roller-cam-for-ford-429-460.html


https://www.429-460.com/t23410-466-aluminum-scj-cylinder-heads

Enough about old cams. A lot of new stuff out now to pick from.

Both Builds look Nice and not Exotic as Far as the Basic Short Block.

Don't Forget to Balance the Reciprocating Assemblies.